MicroWiki:Community portal/Archive 7

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This is an archive of past MicroWiki:Community portal discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links.

Domain name

I guess this is where I'm supposed to go, no? In any case, I have no actual opinion on this. Just felt like starting up the discussion. Have fun. Anton 15:54, 14 November 2010 (EST)

What suffixes do we have as options? .com, .net, .org, etc.? Kyng Fyrst 11:49, 15 November 2010 (EST)
My preferred: .com (a more common name, plus i like the sound of it) or .org, because we pretty much are one organization. And I don't like .net.
Parker I 14:55, 15 November 2010 (EST)
All of them are taken or parked. To buy microwiki.com, for example, would cost AU$70 per year. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 19:58, 15 November 2010 (EST)
How about micronationwiki.com/.org or micronationswiki.com/.org? Kyng Fyrst 12:11, 16 November 2010 (EST)
Those don't appear to be taken.
{{subst:User:Parker I)/Signature}} 14:29, 16 November 2010 (EST)
Ok they look like possibilities :) Any other suggestions? § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 17:12, 16 November 2010 (EST)
I would go with .org --Parker I: The President of Secundomia-- 09:43, 19 November 2010 (EST)
Aha! http://www.mwiki.org/ doesn't appear to be taken.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:03, 19 November 2010 (EST)
That sounds okay.--Parker I: The President of Secundomia-- 10:58, 24 November 2010 (EST)
Unfortunately, it's already taken according to Fishy. =( Seeing as we can't find a suitable name yet, I'm fine with the current one till we think up a decent name, if ever.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  14:31, 24 November 2010 (EST)

Fishy found two good domain names: http://www.mnwiki.org and http://www.wikimicro.org which are both available. Personally, I prefer the first one. Anyone else's thoughts?  aldy@wiki:~$ _  20:41, 30 November 2010 (EST)

Monaco?

Can we change this skin to Monaco? Parker I 18:23, 14 November 2010 (EST)

We'll see how we go :) § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 19:56, 15 November 2010 (EST)
Not that I know of, it's something Wikia designed themselves.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  00:58, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Please don't. Monaco's really not worth the additional resources it'll most likely require. Michael Sander, Prime Minister of Optima, 04:14, 21 November 2010 (EST)

SVG support

This wiki can't create thumbnails of SVG images. Is there an extension or something that's required? Jeremy Oakes 08:08, 16 November 2010 (EST)

That's not a good sign. This must be fixed somehow. Kyng Fyrst 12:10, 16 November 2010 (EST)
You should be able to convert SVG to jpg.
{{SUBST:http://microwiki.co.cc/index.php?title=User:Parker_I/Signature}} 17:02, 16 November 2010 (EST)
Yes that can be fixed easily :) It's just that we have to specify exactly which extensions are allowable on this wiki rather than the other way around. All we have to do is add the extension to the LocalSettings.php file. If there are any other extensions, please let us know. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 17:14, 16 November 2010 (EST)

Extensions

Extensions time. I would like the following please:

Should be enough for now and thanks in advance. =D  aldy@wiki:~$ _  00:58, 18 November 2010 (EST)

Installed InterWiki, editcount and patroller, but the other two require a special code extension which I'll install tomorrow. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 02:15, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Thanks. =D Could you also please install Replace Text? Thanks in advance.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  04:47, 18 November 2010 (EST)
As well as FCKeditor (Official) please for all those who prefer WYSIWYG editors and MultiUpload to help upload multiple files at once (will come in handy when we're copying over all the files).  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:16, 20 November 2010 (EST)

Signature help!

My signature isn't working. {{SUBST:http://microwiki.co.cc/index.php?title=User:Parker_I/Signature}} 21:06, 16 November 2010 (EST)

Correct. =P In your preferences, change it to just {{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}}. I think.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  21:22, 16 November 2010 (EST)
Nope. {{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}} 21:24, 16 November 2010 (EST)
Yes, that's because you've currently got it like [[User:Parker I|{{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}}]] when it should be just {{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}}. I think.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  05:45, 17 November 2010 (EST)
Nope. {{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}} 09:40, 17 November 2010 (EST)
You sure? =S Because if it's just {{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}}, then when you sign ~~~~, it should appear as just --Parker I: The President of Secundomia-- as opposed to {{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}}. It seems that your preferences currently have it like [[User:Parker I|{{SUBST:User:Parker I/Signature}}]]. If it isn't and it's actually done correctly... I haven't any idea what's happened.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  00:58, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Ah I fixed it. It was automatically linking my signature to my user page, disregarding wikitext. However, I disabled this feature, and it works.--Parker I: The President of Secundomia-- 20:44, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Good to hear.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:03, 19 November 2010 (EST)

Rajputistan taken control of old MW?

Rajputistan has taken control of the old MW, and They have removed our moving link. We must get on there and stop them. Parker I 21:31, 16 November 2010 (EST)

Who unprotected the page and removing admin rights? :S Something screwy going on here... § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 01:09, 17 November 2010 (EST)
Don't worry, I've adopted the old wiki so all nations there can hopefully be treated more equally. Kyng Fyrst 18:28, 17 November 2010 (EST)
More equally?Michael Sander, Prime Minister of Optima, 01:30, 29 November 2010 (EST)

RAGE

Thank you to Parker for first raising suspicions, but Wikia has seen fit to:

  1. Remove all admins from the old MicroWiki, except for the four 'admins' who last logged in in 2006 and nobody knows who they are.
  2. Remove the redirect image from the front page

We are now basically powerless at the moment to do anything about this, as the Main Page is protected and none of us are admins anymore over there.

It goes without saying that this move just shows that the wiki move away from these Draconian simpletons couldn't have come sooner.

Ideas on what to do? § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 01:33, 17 November 2010 (EST)

I've asked to adopt the Wiki *rolls eyes*, in which case I'll just re-appoint you all anyway. We have to link to discussion about the move as opposed to the actual site (stupid bureaucratic behaviour) so...grrr. ><  aldy@wiki:~$ _  05:53, 17 November 2010 (EST)
Wow. Wikia sure does seem a bit Orwellian nowadays. Anton 10:52, 17 November 2010 (EST)
Naaaw, he's actually read the Community portal, there's no way he'll appoint me now. =(  aldy@wiki:~$ _  14:20, 17 November 2010 (EST)
Wikia has every right to do this. I suggest not worrying about it, and please especially refrain from "RAGE". :) Kyng Fyrst 14:31, 17 November 2010 (EST)
No they have no right. The wiki may be on their wiki farm, but it's not their property. Now what we're going to see is a split in the community between those who remain on Wikia and those who don't. Oh and thanks for consulting the rest of us - so much for "equality"... § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 19:40, 17 November 2010 (EST)
Legally, it is their property. Also, who says they can't be active on both? Kyng Fyrst 11:48, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Being active on both just creates a redundant second copy of a wiki for no reason. Also, please show me the legal text that shows me that my content is their property. Nothing in the Creative Commons Legal Code or Wikia Terms of Use says anything about that. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 19:42, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Keeping this community together, maintaining our existing relations with other users, is a good reason. And you are correct, the content actually belongs to the general public under the GNU License. Kyng Fyrst 20:34, 18 November 2010 (EST)
So you want to keep the community together by splitting it in two? :S Also, you still haven't outlined exactly what was wrong with the previous situation three days ago. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 00:18, 19 November 2010 (EST)
We can stay together by being active on both. I'm hoping to find a good way to address all these concerns, since controversy simply doesn't bring peace very well. Kyng Fyrst 12:04, 19 November 2010 (EST)
I *really* don't see the point. What advantages does Wikia have over a privately hosted one?  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:03, 19 November 2010 (EST)
There is no need to return to Wikia, especially since this wiki has been well constructed, but any who would like to are free to choose either or even both. Kyng Fyrst 19:32, 19 November 2010 (EST)
There is not need to reactive the Wikia wiki. There is no reason why people should be given a "choice" (there is no "choice" even if both wikis are to remain active). The very few who remain behind have absolutly no chance of keeping it up to date, which is why the community, not a bunch of self-opinionated micronationalists, decided to leave the old wiki as an archive and totally move to this one. Here is the community decision: http://micronations.wikia.com/wiki/MicroWiki:Community_Portal/Archive_3#Our_options_and_opinions. The Community has moved - there is no 'Wikia Community'. Please, for all our sakes, stop this insanity now. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 04:58, 20 November 2010 (EST)
No, there is no "need", but there is a desire for options. There is no "need" for a choice, but having a choice is desired. We might fail in keeping the wiki up-to-date (which many many old pages were already becoming anyway), but we wish to do what we can. If you want to join us, you are welcome, but otherwise we ask you to please not make the problem worse. Kyng Fyrst 18:24, 20 November 2010 (EST)

No Adding to the Vast Pool of Knowledge

Okay, I've had enough searching. How does one create a new page on here? I can't find a button anywhere! Has the New Page button been switched off or something, or is it not compatible with all this MediaWiki stuff? I can't find a New Page button on ShoutWiki or Referata either. Some help would be greatly appreciated! (and to any Grammar Nazis in our presence, I deliberately capitalised that heading) --[[Daniel Anderson]], Premier of the [[Federal Commonwealth of Sirocco]] since 2010. Nemine Contradicente. 23:44, 17 November 2010 (EST)

Well I just search the title of the page I want to create and it will ask you if you would like to create the page
--Kozuc 00:04, 18 November 2010 (EST)
I've asked about adding an extension which does that.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  00:58, 18 November 2010 (EST)
Thanks for pointing that out. I'll add a 'create page' link in the sidebar. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 01:37, 18 November 2010 (EST)

Subdomains

The issue that is Wikia

Okay, everyone. Time for a vote. Kyng claims that in the original vote that we didn't specify what would happen to the Wikia MicroWiki. So, now we shall vote. Here are the options:

  1. Wikia stays as an archive
  2. Wikia stays active as a second community
  3. Wikia stays active with the same community
  4. Wikia gets abandoned
  5. Wikia becomes the central community

So, vote, usual way.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:03, 19 November 2010 (EST)

Okay, ignore this and go to http://micronations.wikia.com/wiki/User:A-One/Voting_on_the_Future to carry out the vote 'properly' on Wikia.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:04, 20 November 2010 (EST)

Voting

Voting closed.

Commenting

The MicroWiki of Wikia is no longer subject to the decisions of this community, and therefore no vote will be effective there unless this community returns there. We here should be focused on the maintenance of this wiki, not what we have left. Kyng Fyrst 19:34, 19 November 2010 (EST)

Oh please, I could ask everyone to just do a similar vote on Wikia if it pleases you, but it honestly wouldn't make a difference. The community on here, the MicroWiki community, is just as much a community on Wikia.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  22:21, 19 November 2010 (EST)
Ok right then, please yourself. We will carry out this vote on Wikia. Here's the link everyone - go and vote! http://micronations.wikia.com/wiki/MicroWiki:Community_Portal#IMPORTANT_-_VOTING_ON_FUTURE_.28Mark_II.29 § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 05:05, 20 November 2010 (EST)
Normally, I'd make a polite comment here. Not today. Kyng Fyrst, you're being quite a prick right now. Anton 05:33, 20 November 2010 (EST)
Philip, I'm sorry, but the community still has not returned. They are active here at MicroWiki.co.cc, but if they want the Wikia MicroWiki to become an archive or to be deleted, then they have not returned to activity there. Wikia has already made the decision, and we must move forward now. Kyng Fyrst 10:53, 20 November 2010 (EST)
Define "active" then. Everyone who's voted has logged on and posted within the last week. Pretty active to me.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  17:04, 20 November 2010 (EST)
Wikia has absolutely no right to make any decision regarding a community. To them, the Wikia wiki is a convenient revenue-raiser and 'just a wiki', but to us it was our entire community. Now that the community has moved, except for a select stubborn few, the wiki moves with it.
Also, I will post the comment I just did on the OAM forum here for convenience: "Kyng - we tried very hard to satisfy you. We tried diplomatic pressure, that didn't work. We considered tolerating the current situation, but that is unacceptable. We tried negotiation, that isn't working. We even tried democracy on both wikis, but you refuse to accept the will of the people. Thus, if the 'new' Wikia admins do not accept the community decision of the vote currently in place on Wikia, I'm afraid that I will have to request that all pages related to A1 on the old Wiki be immediately removed, a request that cannot be refused. I would also encourage others to do the same". And I mean that. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 17:50, 20 November 2010 (EST)
Aldrich, "active" refers to those people who are trying to improve the wiki by their contributions. Since many participants in the recent poll do not fit this description, it cannot be considered a fair vote in the community's best interest.
Philip, some of us have moved along with most of co.cc, but some do not want to be forced to do this. I do not see how the removal of the A1 pages is required if you request it, so please let me know why it must be done in the above situation. However, even if it is not required, we shall respect your request and delete the pages if it comes to that unfortunate result. Kyng Fyrst 18:24, 20 November 2010 (EST)
I think you mean everyone has moved entirely to this wiki except for about 5 users. As I already explained, we simply do not have the time or resources to maintain three separate copies of the same information over three wikis (Onepedia, MicroWiki, and the Hijacked Wikia). As I also already explain, we hope that it does not have to come to that. Kyng - save what is left of your shattered micronational reputation and standing and drop this scheme for the good of the single community. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 20:04, 21 November 2010 (EST)

If I may interject my opinion, my free and honest opinion, I don't agree that what Kyng Fyrst is doing is either right or wrong. He is still a friend of mine and Starland and the Slinky Empyre will always remain an ally of ours. And I don't think we should all be jumping all over him. I mean seriously, I think you all are blowing this way out of proportion. You act like he's confessed to being Osama bin Laden or something. I myself am active on this wiki and the other wiki as well so frankly I think whatever people choose to do is up to them. So if a selct few want to have their own wiki, who are we to judge? Yes they are stubborn but its their choice. I will leave it at that. ~Madam Secretary of State Victoria Bristow Starland 04:14 November 22, 2010 (UTC) P.S. The way you said the Kyng's "shattered reputation" really hit me in the gut as well. How could the micronational community treat him that way, b/c he suggested an alternative? To be honest, and I don't mean to sound rude, but I actually think you are all being immature about this.

Wiki editor

I've heard from a number of people complaining about the wiki's editor and wanting one like the Wikia one back. I've been doing a bit of research, and it appears that it is possible to introduce a simpler WYSIWYG editor, or similar, that makes editing easier. There are a number of stable options:

That's pretty much it for stable releases I'm afraid.

Comments, preferences and comments please :) § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 18:00, 20 November 2010 (EST)

Personally I prefer FCKeditor because it doesn't force it on all users (it seems MeanEditor does that). For that reason alone, I'm leaning towards FCKeditor.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  18:08, 20 November 2010 (EST)
FCKeditor looks like the one we left on Referata. I found that a bit trickier to use than Wikia, but it's vastly superior to HTML. Could we have some instructions on how to implement this please? Thank you. [[User:SiroccanGov|Daniel Anderson, Premier of the Federal Commonwealth of Sirocco since 2010. Nemine Contradicente.]] 18:22, 20 November 2010 (EST)
FCKeditor was my favourite feature of Referata. It's much better.  ~⁠~⁠♥⁠~⁠~ Jeremy Oakes (words • deeds)  20:57, 20 November 2010 (EST)
Ok thanks for the feedback :) I'll install the FCKeditor soon. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 01:54, 22 November 2010 (EST)
Good! I like FCK. --ParkerI: ThePresident of Secundomia-- 13:04, 22 November 2010 (EST)
Installed :) It can be enabled and disabled permanently through the 'Rich Editor' button above the wikitext formatting toolbar at the top of the editing page. § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 18:49, 23 November 2010 (EST)

Copying files

So, as you all know, there's a whole bunch of files we have to copy over from Wikia. If you want to help...here's the place to do so. There are a number of ways of saving then uploading files to here. But first, how to do it in an organised manner. A list of all files on Wikia can be found here. As you can see, all the files are in a group, starting from $1000LBP.jpg to 435px-Mussolini-ggbain.jpg all the way to Ypressn.png to 단군.jpg. These groups are useful for copying them over - it allows us to do so group by group, keeping track of who's doing what and where they're up to. How? It's simple. Choose a group to do. Post that you're doing that group (e.g. Lpe flag.png to NEWPRUSSIA.jpg) and start saving and uploading. What's an easy way to do this? Well, you can do it whatever way you want really. My personal way of doing it is as follows (I use Firefox): First off, download this add-on for Firefox and customize it to your choosing. Go to the page of the group (e.g. this) and click on, say, twenty links. Then go to each tab and click on the image so you're viewing just the image. Cycle through each tab (Ctrl+Tab) doing the same thing for each. Then right click to go to the context menu >> Save images >> Save images from ALL tabs. Ta-dah! It saves it all to a specified folder. Repeat for the next three hundred images. Yes, it takes a while. Don't upload them on here yet as the single upload takes way too long and instead wait when the multiple upload extension is installed. Also, when you do upload the files, don't bother with any file descriptions, as I'll import all the file pages in one go. Now, what groups are there to do. Well, I've already downloaded the first group ($1000LBP.jpg to 435px-Mussolini-ggbain.jpg) and I believe Reinhardt is downloading the second, while Soergel is saving the third. I'll do the fourth tomorrow and the rest is up to you. Be patient and have fun. =D  aldy@wiki:~$ _  01:30, 21 November 2010 (EST)

I've just uploaded three files, these being pictures of myself, Jesse Coles and Livia Aïrosser. Livia's photo uploaded fine and everything is running smoothly for her, but for Jesse and myself our pages and photos are completely inaccessible. All it produces is a white screen and nothing loads. Could someone tell me what on earth is going on here, is MicroWiki being sexist all of a sudden or something or have I accidentally screwed up the whole thing?
Daniel Anderson, Premier of the Federal Commonwealth of Sirocco since 2010. Nemine Contradicente. 19:13, 21 November 2010 (EST)
That happened previously while uploading a flag for one of the Yablokon Areas, I haven't a clue what's wrong with the files though... I just ended up deleting it.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  22:42, 21 November 2010 (EST)
If I could get to the photos themselves I'd try and sort something out, but I can't even get access to them! They're behaving in exactly the same way as the pages. If one of the admins could help me fix this I'd be very appreciative. Could it be the file size of the photos that's crashed the pages?
Daniel Anderson, Premier of the Federal Commonwealth of Sirocco since 2010. Nemine Contradicente. 03:20, 22 November 2010 (EST)

Encyclopedia/Encyclopaedia/Encyclopædia

Which should we be? Personally, I'm leaning towards the first one, no fancy stuff, and it's the one used on Wikipedia.  aldy@wiki:~$ _  01:30, 21 November 2010 (EST)

I prefer the UK/Australian/New Zealand/South African/Optiman variant encyclopaedia, but I'll go with whatever's there now. Michael Sander, Prime Minister of Optima, 04:09, 21 November 2010 (EST)
I prefer the simple encyclopedia. Anything involving paedia sounds too much like paedophile to me. Just sayin'. Anton 07:11, 21 November 2010 (EST)
I have no idea why we're concerning ourselves with this, but I prefer encyclopedia. [[Daniel Anderson]], Premier of the [[Federal Commonwealth of Sirocco]] since 2010. Nemine Contradicente. 19:15, 21 November 2010 (EST)
'Encyclopædia' is the accepted version in all codified varieties of English except for U.S. English (look at Encyclopædia Britannica). The 'æ' is from Old English, like the correct spelling of 'mediæval'. Wikipedia is run by a U.S. resident and U.S. English speaker, which explains why. Also, Wikipedia runs on a 'fact by consensus' basis, which is a hopelessly stupid of maintaining an encyclopædia, but I'll leave that for a rant on another day :P § Fishy § Your friendly neighbourhood Admin (Talk • Contribs) 20:02, 21 November 2010 (EST)
"Encyclopædia" I like fancy complicated names. --Parker I: The President of Secundomia-- 13:06, 22 November 2010 (EST)

Copyright

Is there any agreement as to which licence is MicroWiki under? Currently, depending upon where you look, there are three licences, being:

  • GFDL
  • CC-BY 3.0 (Unported)
  • CC-BY-SA 3.0 (Unported)

The Wikia content is on CC-BY-SA, so it probably is a violation of IP law to license the content under anything else, unless we license the old stuff from the dump under CC-BY-SA, and the new stuff under a different licence, which would be useless, in my opinion, and a pain in the arse to implement. If it does turn out that we're not tied to CC-BY-SA, we have five practical options:

  • GFDL. In my opinion, a bad idea. This is really intended for software documentation, and doesn't have the features that MicroWiki may need in the future.
  • CC-BY. This is the second-best option, in my opinion. Allows redistribution and modification of content by anyone for any purpose, and relicensing.
  • CC-BY-SA. I consider this to be the best option. Allows redistribution and modification of content by anybody, for any purpose, on the proviso that derivatives must be licensed under CC-BY-SA. It eliminates the possibility of any conflict with the old Wikia licensing, and provides slightly more protection than CC-BY.
  • CC-BY-SA-NC. Same as CC-BY-SA, but commercial use is not allowed.
  • A custom licence. Possible, but unnecessary.

It should be noted that CC-BY content can be ported to any other licence, and that GFDL most likely can be ported to CC-BY-SA. Like I said, however, it's possible that we've inherited a CC-BY-SA licence from Wikia, and even if we haven't, reapplying our old Wikia licence prevents any sort of legal wrangling on Wikis's part. Michael Sander, Prime Minister of Optima, 00:58, 21 November 2010 (EST)

I like CC-BY-SA, especially given Wikia's licensing. Jeremy "ouch.jars" Oakes, Prince of Optima 01:44, 21 November 2010 (EST)
Whichever one is Wikipedia's license.--Parker I: The President of Secundomia-- 13:06, 22 November 2010 (EST)
Notice: Why is this wiki is licensed with GFDL when wikia was cc-by-sa?. Should be modified if it is intended to move the contents from there. Regards.--Jatrobat 01:42, 28 November 2010 (EST)
The lovely Sir Demontux has fixed up the copyright notices for us. Michael Sander, Prime Minister of Optima, 02:13, 2 December 2010 (GMT)
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